Decency

So my question is, why, in a world where most people are self-absorbed, apathetic, and bad people, does one continue to try and follow the basic principles he believes is necessary to be a good person? Why...and is it worth it? Is it the right thing to do?

In essence, the heart of this thread is, can someone be a good person in a bad world?

You can read my following narrative that really got me thinking about those questions if you want. The questions are repeated at the end.


A while back, two years ago, I was really involved in certain programs at my school. It wasnt for college or anything either, I was doing it because I wanted to. I stopped after some personal stuff happened, but thats not important.

I live in Chicago, which is, like most big cities, a harsh place. I grew up in the city, not on the South Side where all the gang violence occurred, but close enough that I saw enough of it. Kids were born into that life, I mean, Chicago has one of the highest rates of kids killing kids. Walking home was dangerous because there was a high probability you would get mugged. It wasn't the best life, but it was the only one I knew. I think I was 8 when I left my friends house and saw a man in a car across the street, a bullet through his head, brain matter splattered over his seat. Thats everyday Chicago, not to mention the corruption which supposedly only ranks behind Moscow and Washington D.C.

Anyways, we eventually moved out to the suburbs of Chicago, which was a much more nicer ambiance. We moved to probably one of the more affluent locations, my dads company had taken off. And it was a whole new kind of life. And most of the people I met had been born into that kind of life, a complete contrast to the one I had grown up in. Anyways, so when my high school offered certain programs to aid intercity schools, I was personally motivated to join them. We started out small, fundraising for certain schools to give them enough materials. Most intercity schools are poor beyond belief. But I eventually did a shadowing program and became involved in the lives of a group of kids. Together with other students and sponsors, we helped get the kids off the streets, away from the life of drugs and gangs that was handed to them. It wasn't a large number. 4 people. But I always thought I made a tiny difference in the large scheme of things, and a huge difference in those people's lives.

There's plenty of videos I can show you of how bad it is here, but I always thought I did something that changed someone's life. Anyways, this backstory of a personal narrative of mine is given to you to pose a serious question. Today my dad, angry at a lot of other stuff going on, told me a lot of stuff. Lots of it is tangential to this thread's purpose, but the main thing he told me was along the following lines. He's a ruthless business person type. He attends to the idea that since he managed to turn his life around, everyone else is capable of that. That effort and time shouldn't be given to those who will not benefit from it nearly as much as say I could have. Usually, I would write off such a talk as some sort of typical social Darwinism.

But lately, I've been feeling like he may be onto something. I've always been the kinda guy who puts others' feelings before my own. If you don't believe me, I guess my egotistic air changed your perspectives of me. But if you get to know me, thats unfortunately something people realize quickly. And because of that, I've been used. I've been hurt. And for some reason, I still continue to do it. I tell myself that for once I need to think of myself, but i never do. And those 4 children? I dont know where they are now. The chances are most likely they got sucked into the gang life once again. I spent 1 and a half years trying to fix just a tiny portion of a large problem, and I cant even check to see if my impact even affected one life. Its disheartening.


So my question is, why, in a world where most people are self-absorbed, apathetic, and bad people, does one continue to try and follow the basic principles he believes is necessary to be a good person? Why...and is it worth it? Is it the right thing to do?

Those questions intrigue me, so I just wanted to see what some responses were.

 

Mostly it's a sense of self worth, or personal value.. and by that I mean, I like to befriend people when I can, because that means in this large world I know one more person, and it helps to give me a better understanding of things in different perspectives when I can talk to people, get to know them better, etc. To me, that's profit. I don't enjoy trying to promote myself farther for my own gain, or at the expense of others, because in retrospect everything you do doesn't mean much anyways. So, why not just do what makes you happy? Be yourself, would you really be happy if it ment the sadness, or discontent for someone else? I know I wouldn't, but there are others that would be, because they're more concerned about themselves. That being said, they might also do it because it benefits those around them (such as their family) if they push forward to gain for themselves, in which case it might just seem there intentions are bad to others, but really they're just looking out for people they care fors best interest.

So for me? It's worth it to try and be a good person, because I see the the bonds and positive changes I make in peoples lives as being more important than any sense of self worth I can try to promote myself not really having, I'm just another person like anyone else, and if I were to pass tomorrow, atleast I'll die knowing that I atleast tried to make these positive things happen, and who knows.. the slightest positive change can mean a great thing in the future. I wont know unless I do try, right?

 

That's quite a story there, Ryan. I must say I'm impressed and the programs you've participated in get you some + points from me. I remember that one thread you made in the past, about that one army guy that told you a bunch of his achievements and personally motivated you, and put you down for the stuff you've already done, which were nothing compared to things he had done, but let's not get more off-track.

I'm quite interested in those videos, to be honest, since well... I don't know much about Chicago, and it'd widen my US knowledge a little, I suppose. And I actually quite agree with your dad, everyone has it in them in order to turn their life around and head towards their goals and live a great life, or rather... a life with money, which makes many things more possible and life more passable. But, I disagree with the whole ruthlessness to an extent.

Either way, some people need a push and some guidance in order to obtain a decent position in society. You being a part of helping those 4 children is something you should be proud of, I'd say. You gave them a little boost and tried with whatever ways you could to help them. You've impacted their life for sure, I'd say. You gave them an opportunity to start over and get themselves back on track. If they took the chance is up to them, hopefully they did. But if in any case they didn't, you've tried. And that should be good enough to give you a self-satisfactory feeling. Also, be more optimistic about them, lol.

I strongly agree with the sometimes you have to think of yourself thing, always thinking about others may get you hurt a few times too many, this may sound hypocritical coming from me to some people. But, it's the truth, I suppose.

To your questions: The world carries all kinds of people, some are more noticeable than the other, and mostly the 3 mentioned, by you, pop-up mostly. If you don't follow the principles you have, wouldn't you categorize yourself like them? I believe it's right to have your principles and following them, it makes you a better person in most cases. Absolutely worth it if it gives you that satisfactory feeling that boils up inside of you. You've done what you can, what happens next, depends on the person who has the ball in their hands, after you.

Either way, should probably note that your thread kinda blew me off a little, so.. in case I don't make sense here and there, I blame you.

 

Thanks for your input guys, as for some videos, here you go ;o

[video=youtube;jeUlYtmi0ik]http/www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeUlYtmi0ik[/video]

[video=youtube;lVhXbjxUdVE]http/www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVhXbjxUdVE[/video]

there's so many more, just google it x.x. its really sad.

 

People do what they believe is right. Its true that this world's going to hell in a handbasket (no religious references meant), but this doesn't mean YOU have to be with those people. In a world tainted with corruption, hate, selfishness and war, morality is its own reward. People follow their principles, and honestly more than anything you should follow what you believe to be right. Everyone has a sense of ethics, its learned early on in childhoold. You need to do what gets you to sleep at night, because in the end thats all that matters. People will judge, whether or not they have the right to. You can be the world's biggest ******* and still be comfortable with it, but as soon as you're not, there's no reason for you to continue being that way.

The reason you put others before yourself is because thats simply the way you are. People WILL sometimes take advantage of this, but the thing is, that sometimes kindness is returned, and by being a good person you will have good luck. I'm not saying bad things don't happen to good people, because bad things DO happen to good people. The thing that you've got to ask yourself is, "would I want the help, or would I expect the help if I were in that position of need?" Its pretty much the most basic of all moral teachings "do unto others as you'd have them do unto you."

You can be as ruthless as you want, and in all honesty ruthless people often gain the most wealth and power. You can continue being kind, in reality I don't think you can be ruthless, because as much as I hate to say it, people are sort of born that way (not always, but mostly). I think it all lies in what lets you sleep at night, because, trust me, no matter what, when you're alone with your thoughts they will eat at you and harm you more than anyone else can, so just do what floats your boat!

 

Jesus, that's just horrible. x.x I remember the first video, how can I be so stupid and forget x.x"

 

I agree. I never said I wanted to be ruthless, I just feel like sometimes efforts go to waste. But you're right, its who I am. I'm just not good at thinking whats smart for myself sometimes, but I dont think I could change that even if I wanted to.

But yeah, as Chris said, I met an ex Navy Seal who really interested me. I couldn't believe the kinds of stuff he did, the fact that he traveled throughout South America and Africa just to help people who were less fortunate than us. I think he was the first person to really show me that there are honestly good and sincere people out there in the world.

I met this one kid from my school. He was going to travel to Haiti when the earthquake hit to help out. I asked him why he did it, and his response was "It will look great on my college app."

More than naught, people tend to do things that are self-gratifying. I'm noticing that in some of my familial relationships as well. So I feel like there's no place for being selfless, but I think you're right Fade. I'm happy with the fact that I managed to sigh away from faking sympathy for those harmed in an earthquake in an impoverished country simply so I could enter a better college.

 

yeah... thats honestly pretty sad, if you're doing something good, then do it out of the goodness of your own heart (yeah yeah I know the heart is pretty much an electric pump which circulates blood, BUT YOU GET MY POINT!!!). Its disheartening, but think about it this way, whether or not the person did it for a good reason or a bad one, if the means justify the end, then the result is always worthwhile. People get the help they need, and he gets his fluffed up college app, in reality its a win win, whether its morally correct or not is another thing. You don't need a good reason to do good things, actually, you don't need a reason at all. Some people believe that you should only do something for the general kindness, but in reality much good has been done with alternate intents

 

This is actually quite profound. I agree, but thats the thing that I'm questioning. Out of all these people, the ones who are making a difference in the world, so many of them are doing it for self-gratifying reasons. The tiiiny portion, the tiny percent of 6 billion people who are truly good, sincere, selfless people, they aren't able to change thing.

I know there's a quote that goes something like, even a raindrop raises the level of the ocean. But I live my life to the principles I set, and I keep having everything I understood crack from underneath me. I try to be a good person to the best of my abilities, and its never worked for me. And thats the main theme of this thread.

Is it possible to be a decent person in an indecent world? (I think thats a quote ;o)

 

I think it is a matter of belief. being good and helping those people? If you believe in what you did is it stronger than your belief that you didn't put an effect to stop bad things to happen in the world. I think one simple person shouldn't be burdened by big problems like this. I've watched that movie where 1 guy helps 3 people and those 3 people help another 3 people and so a chain of good deeds. If only that were true in real life. If everyone has the belief and their word to doing good. This world as we know it, would change.

 

Don't try to be different. Just be good. To be good is different enough, you do not wake up one morning a bad person. It happens by a thousand tiny surrenders of self-respect to self-interest.​

 

Its all about values... Moral and ethics depends on the cultural and social enviroment you are in, and also depends in the education you get. I dont know how your education was, but you were able to gain values that boost the most of ethics and morality, making you a good person (in what a good person is considered in our social and cultural stablishment). The adquisition of values happens when you are little, so is something you wont change in the course of your life that easily... because everything you learn will be molded by this values you use as fundations.

Thats for the theory. I think is great you are like that, for better or worse life around you affects you and you need to change it for good. I honestly believe that being a good person in this fked world is something good, maybe not for ourselves, but because it means there is still hope that a better tomorrow may arrive... and a better tomorrow is builded by people who believes in it, good people. And just for that its worth.

 

Yeah, education has always been important to my parents (another story in itself) but I got the best one possible. More importantly though, my morals and ethics were influenced by a lot of things, and I think they did shape me into making good choices in my life. Certain events course-corrected me and once again influenced me into making what I consider smart decisions. And I'm realizing that that is a good thing, I managed to become a person I'm proud of. And i mean, I've my own issues with always trying to please everyone before myself and constantly worrying about others. I thought it was just too much empathy. But I think now, at the end of the day, I'm still proud that I managed not to betray what I believe in.

Maybe the world isn't suited for decency, but I think, staying above the dirt is something people should be proud of, even if it gets them knocked down once in a while.

And you're right, I managed to vastly change four children's lives, even if it was short-lived. It wasn't a huge thing, it didn't stop the epidemic of violence, drugs, gangs, and corruption that south side Chicago is, but I feel like I made a difference in 4 people's lives. Maybe it took 1 and a half years of my life, but I think now that it was worth it, to give them a chance for a whole new one.

 

Bump bump, I just want some new ideas on the topic ;o

 

You see, by being good you have a small chance to succeed in life just because there aren't many people that really value good persons. However, if you find one of those people, the reward would be much better than by being around bad people, just like you.
I hope you understand what I've said. It's like a road that splits into a crossroad: on one side there's light and you know where you're going and what you get. The other one is dark, but you can feel that you're going to get much more from it, even though it's more "dangerous".

 

I don't think life is as clear-cut as your metaphor, but I agree. More risk leads to greater rewards ;o. And yeah, you're right. Good people get a very bad rep. I know that personally, I thought Drew Brees was a complete douche and had no respect for him. Why? Because he played for the New Orleans Saints, a team I disliked.

However, after actually getting to know his story and what he did, I have so much respect for him. In a world where celebrities have no self-respect, this guy basically helped rebuild an entire city. The city loves him for it, of course, but so many people disrespect him. They look up to people like Adult Beiber Brady and Peyton Manning. I know, me using a football comparison is a bit trite, but it works. People just don't respect good deed and good values.

 

i think the best is to just be urself , be unique , and if it's in you to be a good person than it'll show up , if not ... u can always try to develop into one

 

Meh, I just want to make people happy and make a difference for them. If thats what you consider "good" or not, idk. But I think, honestly, that one can't develop into a "good person." You can't lie to yourself, you can't pretend you're something you're not.

 

maybe they can't turn into good ones , but they can at leas try it ^^
and yes trying to make others happy , as long as it makes you happy too , makes u a good person

 

Doesn't seem to be making me that happy lately though. But I'll still be...just me. I guess its just who I am